Changing Backgrounds (animated, non picture backgrounds)

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Azzco
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Changing Backgrounds (animated, non picture backgrounds)

Postby Azzco » Sat Jan 31, 2009 1:18 pm

First off I have to say that I really hate using still image bakgrounds. Having looked a bit on "animated" frame by frame bakgrounds, I still feel that they're a bit to.. short and large.

I really loved Raphs GH2 mod stage bakground, and I thought a bit about those bakgrounds.

Would it be possible to have more than one stage.ini and change with script.txt or randomly?
For example, a few stages could be made, one viewing the scene from above the audience.
Another from back stage, one from the artists view and some with a closeup on the instruments.

In any case, being able to control the stages used with a script would be awfully nice. But else it would just go randomly. I was thinking about working out a list of views that should be made, and make this sort of a standard, so that songs could utilize this on most themes.

and don't grill this idea, even if it's silly it's still the thoughts section, and it hasn't been discussed before AFAIK (I looked through the what has been discussed thread).
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Re: Changing Backgrounds (animated, non picture backgrounds)

Postby gen_codehazzard » Mon Feb 09, 2009 3:51 pm

thats not bad but i had a theard of .swf of useing flash with fretsonfire (of course it got deleted) but my ideal was useing it to make animated guitar flashing strings or flashy star power side bars etc! i mean flash is simple and easy to do
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Re: Changing Backgrounds (animated, non picture backgrounds)

Postby pimpinpalomo » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:32 pm

wait... what? you want more animated backgrounds? you mean that after it goes through one stage animation, it changes to another set of stages and plays that animation? its a good idea, but im afraid it would increase loading times by a LOT. the average background image is around 1 MB in size, multiply that by at least 50, and you have an extra 15-60 seconds on your loading time (depending on your comp specs). the animated backgrounds we have now are fine anyways.
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Re: Changing Backgrounds (animated, non picture backgrounds)

Postby gen_codehazzard » Mon Feb 09, 2009 6:52 pm

um the backgrounds dont sync with the song and is worst the loading time with them i think the best way to do this is have the backgrounds load according to the song like riff songs would change to the riff like backgrounds or solo parts would change to the solo backgrounds therefore puting it back into sync be a lot of work but would improve it a lot
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Re: Changing Backgrounds (animated, non picture backgrounds)

Postby quakegod667 » Mon Feb 09, 2009 10:43 pm

You mean like Guitar Hero? Sorry, but that would be pretty near impossible without taking an impossible amount of space and amazingly long load times. It just wouldn't work very well, if at all. If you want to have GH-style backgrounds, go play GH.
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Re: Changing Backgrounds (animated, non picture backgrounds)

Postby Azzco » Tue Feb 10, 2009 1:05 am

I'm talking about animated stages like the original stage.ini functionality, not a series of images...
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Re: Changing Backgrounds (animated, non picture backgrounds)

Postby gen_codehazzard » Tue Feb 10, 2009 1:32 am

quakegod667 wrote:You mean like Guitar Hero? Sorry, but that would be pretty near impossible without taking an impossible amount of space and amazingly long load times. It just wouldn't work very well, if at all. If you want to have GH-style backgrounds, go play GH.



um im getting sick and tired of hearing that if i wantted to play gu then i wouldnt waste my time with this game but walt you can do to many things to gh unless it on pc
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Re: Changing Backgrounds (animated, non picture backgrounds)

Postby quakegod667 » Tue Feb 10, 2009 2:11 am

Azzco wrote:I'm talking about animated stages like the original stage.ini functionality, not a series of images...

Oh... well, that I can envision, but wouldn't you have to do some modding to code the timing for everything? I don't know sh*t about modding, but there is also the matter of the stages themselves and getting them to work. The stages would probably be huge in size. And you would need to code the timing and everything.
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Re: Changing Backgrounds (animated, non picture backgrounds)

Postby Azzco » Tue Feb 10, 2009 5:00 am

quakegod667 wrote:
Azzco wrote:I'm talking about animated stages like the original stage.ini functionality, not a series of images...

Oh... well, that I can envision, but wouldn't you have to do some modding to code the timing for everything? I don't know sh*t about modding, but there is also the matter of the stages themselves and getting them to work. The stages would probably be huge in size. And you would need to code the timing and everything.

Actually they're not that big AFAIK. One could get elements of the picture to do certain things during a beat, half beat, when players miss a note, when a note is hit etc with stages.ini.

raph666 linked me to good documentation a few days back but I can't find it again (I don't usually book mark for some reason). :sad:
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Re: Changing Backgrounds (animated, non picture backgrounds)

Postby amich45 » Tue Feb 10, 2009 11:27 pm

Personally I agree with you that the static backgrounds could be tremendously improved. I looked into animated backgrounds but decided not to go there for two reasons. One being load time, but that doesn't seem to be an issue if you have a better computer than me. The other is exactly what you mentioned of them not being synced with the song which would just look really odd. I like the idea you present and there probably is a way of doing it that actually wouldn't be that hard. I have no experience with doing this myself but it seems doable. Hopefully someone might try it. Good luck.
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Re: Changing Backgrounds (animated, non picture backgrounds)

Postby gen_codehazzard » Wed Feb 11, 2009 12:57 am

Hopefully someone might try it. Good luck.
if only luck would help us nobody wants to do it most the top dev`s of fof dont mess with to many ideals and when someone suggest`s them (whether there easy or not) they will put it off that`s why the game only improves on its features and not its looks all these`s clones of rock band and guitar hero. i mean dont get me wrong i love them i enjoy a good game of gh or rb but if i wanted to play them i would play the real thing and not the cloned version it seem`s fof need`s to be recoded and by that i mean

1, the hit glow needs to improve
2, star meter and overdrive needs improve
3, notes and frets could use some improvement (but not much)
4, strumming needs a little improvement

its a really good game its something`s messing in it but thats IMO dou im not a dev im only a player and a artist
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Re: Changing Backgrounds (animated, non picture backgrounds)

Postby Azzco » Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:15 am

amich45 wrote:Personally I agree with you that the static backgrounds could be tremendously improved. I looked into animated backgrounds but decided not to go there for two reasons. One being load time, but that doesn't seem to be an issue if you have a better computer than me. The other is exactly what you mentioned of them not being synced with the song which would just look really odd. I like the idea you present and there probably is a way of doing it that actually wouldn't be that hard. I have no experience with doing this myself but it seems doable. Hopefully someone might try it. Good luck.

Actually the only difference I had in mind compared to the old stages would be the ability to change stage in the song. Just trying to say that it's not my idea about the whole stage animations (old stage animations present in vanilla fof), but there is room for more features I think. I haven't looked into how intense the stages actually are but they're by no means as intensive as a single 50 frames animation.
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Re: Changing Backgrounds (animated, non picture backgrounds)

Postby raph666 » Mon Feb 16, 2009 11:16 am

I would be curious to know what motivation was behind the removal of the stage.ini system in Alarian's mod. I'd also be curious to know what amount of work would be necessary to re-implement it in the current FoFiX releases. The stage.ini system uses layers which can be positioned anywhere across the stage screen. You can then add effects (light, rotate, wiggle, scale) to your layers, effects that are triggered by..well...triggers (beat, quarterbeat, pick, miss)
I used simple effects in my GH mod back then. The most noticeable effects are the lights effects but the crowd also jumps up and down to the beat and the speakers pulses to the beat as well.
The video only really shows the lights effects but anyway:

And if you want to see my stage.ini:

[layer1]
texture = bg2.svg
xres = 775
yres = 512
xscale = 1.0
yscale = 1.0
xpos = 0.0
ypos = 0.0
angle = 0.0


[layer2]
texture = bg2-2.svg
xres = 775
yres = 100
xscale = 1.0
yscale = 1.0
xpos = 0.0
ypos = 0.82
angle = 0.0


[layer2:fx1]
type = wiggle
trigger = beat
profile = sinstep
xmagnitude = -0.000
ymagnitude = -0.002
frequency = 1
intensity = 0.5


[layer3]
texture = light.svg
xres = 775
yres = 512
xscale = 1.0
yscale = 1.0
xpos = 0.0
ypos = 0.0
angle = 0.0
src_blending = one
dst_blending = one


[layer3:fx1]
type = light
trigger = pick
intensity = 0.001
light_number = 0


[layer4]
texture = speakers.svg
xres = 775
yres = 512
xscale = 1.0
yscale = 1.0
xpos = 0.0
ypos = 0.0
angle = 0.0


[layer4:fx1]
type = scale
trigger = beat
profile = sinstep
xmagnitude = 0.001
ymagnitude = 0.001


[layer5]
texture = light2.svg
xres = 775
yres = 512
xscale = 1.0
yscale = 1.0
xpos = 0.0
ypos = 0.0
angle = 0.0
src_blending = one
dst_blending = one
foreground = 1


[layer5:fx1]
type = light
trigger = pick
intensity = 0.001
light_number = 0

What would be nice in FoFiX would be the addition of new triggers like "midi events" and such. For example, you could use 2 static pictures: one used in normal play and the other (let's say, a guitar closeup image) positioned so it doesn't appear on screen. A "solo" event could then trigger the second image's effect that could be to simply rotate quickly the image into a visible position for the solo period. After the solo, the images goes back to it's "invisible" position and you get your first image back. That's just an example and maybe it wouldn't look that good but there's a lot of other possibilities with the stage.ini already. If it was improved with more effects (fade-in/out for example) and more triggers it could become a very good system.
I guess this was the documentation that was talked about: http://fretsonfire.sourceforge.net/docu ... ing/stage/
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Re: Changing Backgrounds (animated, non picture backgrounds)

Postby SketchMan3 » Tue Feb 17, 2009 2:30 pm

raph666 wrote:I would be curious to know what motivation was behind the removal of the stage.ini system in Alarian's mod.

Yes, I've always wondered about that myself. I mean, the mod is great, and it's the best thing that every could be happening for FoF, but taking out one of the greatest features of FoF version 1.2. never really made sense. I loved the blinking lights and the drum kicking to the beat. I mean, even making the animations change in beat with the song would be awesome. Were people really so desperate for animated stages that they had to resort to frame-by-frame? Not that isn't cool. I made a stage animation myself.

Somebody made a "Band Mod" that had a guy strumming along with the fret buttons. I mean, it's no GH, but having characters that actually at least play the 5 notes that you're playing (If not the whole neck of the guitar) is better than pictures that have nothing to do with what the music is doing.

FoFix uses midi events to for starpower, solos, and practice mode, and so many other things. It would be nice to be able to use midi events for stage automation, also.

If not re-implementing the stage.ini system, it would at least be good if a feature was implemented to change animation sub-folders depending on midi events. For example, you could have a chorus sub-folder, a solo sub-folder, verse, etc.

I hope I don't sound demanding. I'm just throwing out ideas.

To make my ideas seem more possible, here are things that have already been implemented:

*Using midi events other than note_on, etc. (Starpower, Practice sections, solos)
*Beat syncing the stage (In vanilla FoF 1.2.)
*A stage that with a guitarist who moves his hand on the guitar neck according to the notes you press, and strums along with you.

At least a drummer would be horribly easy to implement, since it would merely consist of mapping the hands and kick to play a particular drum depending on the pad button. The only problem with be confusion as to whether the blue pad is a ride cymbal or a tom. But at least it be corresponding to the music in some way.


Another idea would be to allow multiple animation sub-folders to be called at the same time, and arranged in certain places, so, for example you could have a sub-folder to animate the guitarist, the drummer, the bassist, etc. and position them on the screen. Kind of similar to what vanilla FoF does with the stage.ini system. And since the images would be relatively small, it couldn't lag up the game much more than the images that are already being displayed (fret buttons, rock meter, etc.). It would slow down load time...

P.S. The GH mod's lighting was awesome. I just wish I could use it with FoFix.

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