iPad

[aander91]

I don't see why everyone wants the iPad to be exactly how THEY want it. It's just technology. If you don't want to buy it, then don't! Give me one product that has met up to your standards and has never dissappointed you with anything about it. *Waits for Rapt0r's smart-ass response* After you've found that there isn't a single product without it's flaws, go make your own and see how people will respond to it.

No such thing as flawless technology, but there's no point in spending money on something you KNOW has more flaws instead of something that you KNOW has less flaws for the same amount of money. Also, I'm pretty damn impressed with my Asus Laptop. Certainly not flawless, but I'm convinced I got one of the best.

[raph666]

No, seriously, no Flash because:

1. Device can't handle it

If you do not know what you are talking about, maybe it's better not to post. Just to make sure you don't look like an ignorant.
The device can definitely handle it: http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/flas ... or_iphone/

And seriously, Flash stinks. We want more html5

[LedfortheHead]

If they put on a Mac OS X instead of the crap iPhone OS on it there would be a lot less problems.

[crazy.neo]

No, seriously, no Flash because:

1. Device can't handle it

If you do not know what you are talking about, maybe it's better not to post. Just to make sure you don't look like an ignorant.

I searched this subject before posting. Maybe you shouldn't assume stuff.
Apart from an obvious design error:
http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2010/02/2 ... use-flash/

The Flash apps you linked are not Running using using the Flash Player Plugin, but rather seem to use a wrapper that renders pre-translated AS3 into native code. I do not know the limitations of this, but it certainly isn't "running Flash", and certainly doesn't solve the limitation pointed out by us. Apart from that, from the same page you linked:

Flash Player uses a just-in-time compiler and virtual machine within a browser plug-in to play back content on websites. Those technologies are not allowed on the iPhone at this time, so a Flash Player for iPhone is not being made available today.

My belief that the device can't handle it stands. If not from a hardware point of view, then Apple's "LET'S LOCK EVERYTHING DOWN BECAUSE THE USER IS DUMB AND WILL **** IT UP" philosophy puts the nail in the proverbial coffin.

Also, I dislike Flash as much as the next guy but unfortunately HTML5 is a long way from killing Flash. In fact, judging from the current implementations of it, sites like YouTube actually perform slower on my end with HTML5 on, the player doesn't have half the functionality and is pretty buggy (granted, it's baby steps). I've seen some good experiments with HTML5 and it's certainly awesome, but I don't think it will have the widespread acceptance people hope it will (at least not too soon). Plus, internal rivalries in the draft itself (Mozzila's Ogg Theora support vs. the world) make it seem flaky, at least to me.The iPad certainly won't change this issue. If it does, I will lose all faith in humanity, although wlcome it.

[Rapt0r]

Just because x is better than y, doesn't mean you should support y, especially when y is heavily used EVERYWHERE.

[death_au]

Dude, they aren't standards we just made up.
It's what any **** decent pad should have. It's not "Just Technology" it's a product people is going to buy for a **** load of money, so it may as well work for anything more than just streaming mp3s and mp4s.
If you want apple to walk over you then **** on your face and rape the **** out of your ass, then keep it up :)

-- Edit: Tue Apr 06, 2010 2:25 am --

Oh btw, I MAD :P

And that coming from an apple fan certainly says something to me at least.

And seriously, Flash stinks. We want more html5

Agreed. But like crazy.neo said, HTML5 is a long way off killing flash, and the flash environment is much nicer and easier than HTML5. But when enough people start using it, and there's more support and more development libraries and IDEs, then hopefully we'll start to see something good. Flash is a resource hog that runs like crap IMO. I just want something to kill it, HTML5 or not.

[raph666]

Just because x is better than y, doesn't mean you should support y, especially when y is heavily used EVERYWHERE.

Just because w's x is better than y's z doesn't mean y should not sell z.

So we're supposed to just deal with it? Makes sense.

Seriously, yes. What are you going to do anyway? B*tch on forums about it? Makes sense.

The Flash apps you linked are not Running using using the Flash Player Plugin, but rather seem to use a wrapper that renders pre-translated AS3 into native code. I do not know the limitations of this, but it certainly isn't "running Flash", and certainly doesn't solve the limitation pointed out by us. Apart from that, from the same page you linked:

Flash Player uses a just-in-time compiler and virtual machine within a browser plug-in to play back content on websites. Those technologies are not allowed on the iPhone at this time, so a Flash Player for iPhone is not being made available today.

My belief that the device can't handle it stands. If not from a hardware point of view, then Apple's "LET'S LOCK EVERYTHING DOWN BECAUSE THE USER IS DUMB AND WILL **** IT UP" philosophy puts the nail in the proverbial coffin.

Are we really surprised that 2 hyper-proprietary companies have licenses issues? So when Adobe, to replace their JIT compiler for something that goes along Apple's legal term, develops a AOT compiler that offers nearly all the Flash Player 10 and AIR 2 APIs as well as providing hardware accelerated rendering, yes it is running Flash, and it is running it extremely nicely on a mobile OS.
So call that semantics if you must, but yes, there actually is a huge difference between "no Flash because device can't handle it" and "no Flash Player web browser's plugin because Apple won't let the device handle it because of licenses issues".

And seriously, Flash stinks. We want more html5

Agreed. But like crazy.neo said, HTML5 is a long way off killing flash, and the flash environment is much nicer and easier than HTML5. But when enough people start using it, and there's more support and more development libraries and IDEs, then hopefully we'll start to see something good. Flash is a resource hog that runs like crap IMO. I just want something to kill it, HTML5 or not.

I just thought it was extremely funny to see people who criticized Apple's proprietary philosophy for a long time now defend their criticism of an Apple's device using "the lack of a proprietary plugin" as one of their major arguments.

[crazy.neo]

Are we really surprised that 2 hyper-proprietary companies have licenses issues? So when Adobe, to replace their JIT compiler for something that goes along Apple's legal term, develops a AOT compiler that offers nearly all the Flash Player 10 and AIR 2 APIs as well as providing hardware accelerated rendering, yes it is running Flash, and it is running it extremely nicely on a mobile OS.
So call that semantics if you must, but yes, there actually is a huge difference between "no Flash because device can't handle it" and "no Flash Player web browser's plugin because Apple won't let the device handle it because of licenses issues".

It's not a matter of semantics, it's a matter of practicality and availability. You WON'T have free access to it on the web, and have to rely on it being on the Apple store, maybe at a price you wouldn't have to pay otherwise (take Canabalt http://www.adamatomic.com/canabalt/ as an example). I also doubt it's simply a licensing issue, considering the long history of both companies collaborating with each other, and the fact that Apple needs Adobe, not the other way around. I find it easier to believe that the device can't handle JIT compilation effectively while running Safari, especially since no multi-tasking has been introduced yet on iPhone OS.

I just thought it was extremely funny to see people who criticized Apple's proprietary philosophy for a long time now defend their criticism of an Apple's device using "the lack of a proprietary plugin" as one of their major arguments.

I personally have no use for Flash on a mobile platform at all. Nokia has had Flash on their Symbian OS for a long time and I can count by my hand the number of times I had to use it. You can't say that pointing out that a platform that is made for the Internet and interacting with content rich applications on the Internet is missing the most widely used plugin for displaying and interacting with content is a bad argument. On the case of the iPhone I can understand, I personally see no use for it, as I mentioned it before. But in iPad's case, I do see it as a core fault in the device that hinders it's ability for surf the web.

[raph666]

I find it easier to believe that the device can't handle JIT compilation effectively while running Safari

That is exactly what I had in mind when I said:

If you do not know what you are talking about, maybe it's better not to post.

We currently get nearly three million visitors to this page each month from people who are looking for the Flash Player for their iPhone or iPod touch, many of whom were leaving the download center believing that either (1) Adobe didn't want Flash on the iPhone or (2) the iPhone was somehow technically incapable of playing Flash content. Since neither of those is true, we are now explaining to those visitors that Apple holds the key in getting Flash Player onto the device.

I'm not trying to sell you some big iPod touch, I'm just telling you that by posting without really knowing what you say, the credibility of all your other arguments and opinion is decreased. In this kind of topic, both fanboys and haters make it hard to find valid information thus making those topics quite vain and boring.

[tibiazak]

why does everybody do "Micro$oft" when Appl€ is a thousand times worse?

What do you mean by this? It makes no sense?

People use "Micro$oft" when they refer to Microsoft because supposedly they're a greedy evil company. So I put in the euro symbol into Apple, making it Appl€, because I believe that Appl€ is a lot more greedy than microsoft.
[/semi-hijack]

[Rapt0r]

Just because w's x is better than y's z doesn't mean y should not sell z.

So we're supposed to just deal with it? Makes sense.

Seriously, yes. What are you going to do anyway? B*tch on forums about it? Makes sense.

Hurr durr

I was implying that you're supposed to BUY the product anyway.

Also who's **** really? Right now, the only person who looks like they are is you. What I'm having here is a discussion about a product that Apple is way over-hyping that people are just going to buy into without doing any research and then regret it later when they find out how pathetic it is for a "netbook replacement".

[raph666]

Also who's **** really? Right now, the only person who looks like they are is you.

BUT THOSE DON'T HAVE TOUCHSCREEEEEENNSSSS

You'd be infinitely better getting a netbook (with a touchscreen if you must) instead of this ****.

Sorry, $499. That makes it $99 worse.

and then regret it later when they find out how pathetic it is for a "netbook replacement".

Definitely the most unbiased and objective critics. Don't start this way, don't forget I'm here to moderate the discussions.

Who said it had to be a "netbook replacement". When I look at the iPad, I read the specs, see what it is and take it for what it is. If you absolutely have to compare, instead of a "weak netbook", make that a "very powerful e-reader", with a price comparable to the Kindle DX http://www.amazon.com/Kindle-Wireless-R ... =kinww_ddp

[Rapt0r]

How is that even biased? If it was a good product, I would actually argue for it but it most definitely is not and the steep price for it is absolutely ridiculous.

Who said it had to be a "netbook replacement".

How about Steve Jobs? He's been bashing on netbooks and how they suck compared to a real laptop/computer so he makes this to be a replacement for them and to also "fill the gap" between smart phones an laptops. Honestly, this is one gap that never needs to be filled.

[raph666]

Honestly, this is one gap that never needs to be filled.

Why?
I love technology, I love gadgets, I love shiny things. Can there really be too many? In no way am I getting a iPad anytime soon, but I'm not angry that I don't have any use for or any money to spend on this kind of product.

[1Eddy213]

Drum machine apps will rock. Maybe with the big screen the virtual guitarist apps will actually be playable.