First Sony, Now Nintendo...Xbox Next

[aander91]

hurr durr, write this like i cant read...durr. I understand what rapt0r said, he's just taking the wrong light in this. Before you or he says I'm being ignorant, or arrogant. I have one thing to say. I've been a forum punching bag for 2+ years. He's just mad cause I'm not taking it like a b**ch anymore. The only reason i get ignorant, is when I know im right and no one else sees. It's like we're all looking at a giant Where's Waldo and im the only one who can see him, but no one believes me cause i cried waldo too many times falsely (Could have used the Boy who cried wolf analogy here aswell). Let me guess who else was treated the exact same way...oh I know Motorhead14. I'm done with a lot of you, you guys love to blow opinions right out of proportion. <insert comment comparing certain members to American stereo-type> and done.

I just want to make sure you know this, you just put yourself on the same level as motorhead. I can't help but to think that you just didn't read your own post.

[Rapt0r]

Okay, both sides have said their piece and they're not going to convince the other. I don't want to lock this topic yet, but if you keep arguing I'm going to have to.

...There is no reason for this thread to be locked. We are having a debate on Sony's actions and actually discussing this. What do you think should be written on this forum? Everyone agrees with everything happy good time with no disagreements?

>Credit card info was encrypted... ...are nice to have, eh.
I really don't think you read his post at all. You mentioned that this is nothing different than Microsoft or Nintendo. He said Microsoft and Nintendo has never had their customers CC info stolen which is correct.

>I say that's more then bandwidth cost. Not to mention many people could/will take advantage of this and purchase the discounted games. This is something that will cost Sony.

You're acting like that even with this discount, Sony will be selling these games at a loss. It will all still turn a profit. Sure, it won't be as much money as they could have been making but how many of those sales will only be happening because of the discount that would not have happened otherwise? Sure is business classes paying off I see.

>I'm done with a lot of you, you guys love to blow opinions right out of proportion. <insert comment comparing certain members to American stereo-type> and done.

amak.quittingCount++;

Stop getting mad that people don't agree with you. No one is making you "a forum punching bag". You're not that special. Every single word that has said here would have been exactly the same if Lydestic, Tibi, Vedi, or even Nwru had posted what you have.

[aander91]

...There is no reason for this thread to be locked. We are having a debate on Sony's actions and actually discussing this. What do you think should be written on this forum? Everyone agrees with everything happy good time with no disagreements?

This. No one has thrown any fighting words besides Amak with his little racist moment.

[Rapt0r]

> The only reason i get ignorant, is when I know im right and no one else sees.

wow, how did I miss this? I love irony. Was this intentional?

[tibiazak]

...There is no reason for this thread to be locked. We are having a debate on Sony's actions and actually discussing this. What do you think should be written on this forum? Everyone agrees with everything happy good time with no disagreements?

This. No one has thrown any fighting words besides Amak with his little racist moment.

It's not the fighting words or lack thereof, it's the fact that the last couple pages have basically been a relatively personal argument between you guys and amak. It's OBVIOUS you guys are not going to change each other's minds, so stop trying to convince amak, and stop doing things like

> The only reason i get ignorant, is when I know im right and no one else sees.

wow, how did I miss this? I love irony. Was this intentional?

That right there is the definition of an off-topic argument. If you're going to refute an argument, refute the argument. Don't comment on the person themselves, even if it's laughing at something they said.

[aander91]

Well then tell amak to stop making this personal. Everytime a debate like this crops up he goes into a huge rant that eventually becomes "everyone hates me Im sick of it". Just give him a warn and tell him to stop posting crap.

[amak11]

Just a small bit: American = not a race, therefore im not being racist.
I wouldnt 'debate' if you guys didnt blow my opinions way out of proportion. That's it's all ever about.

[Rapt0r]

I can't talk about your opinions and why I disagree? Why even post your opinion then?

[vedicardi]

How about let's all stop posting and defeat the purpose of having a forum in the first place: discussion! Brilliant!

[tibiazak]

How about let's all stop posting and defeat the purpose of having a forum in the first place: discussion! Brilliant!

How about lets learn the difference between argument and debate. Seriously guys. Amak, people are allowed to disagree with you, and people are allowed to misunderstand your points. Raptor: people are allowed to be WRONG.

Debate is when you present a viewpoint (or an alternative viewpoint) based on evidence. And then you and the other person present counter-evidence, and at some point decide to stop the debate because A) you have no more evidence; B) you concede the point; C) they concede the point; or D) you both realize your evidence is not convincing the other and therefore agree to disagree.

Argument is when you let emotions enter a debate and you start thinking (or typing) "you idiot" or variations on the same theme. The first thing to realize is that arguments string from debates where you aren't willing to accept that people can be WRONG. When you aren't willing to say "well, I'm not changing your mind." and then drop the subject, emotions take over. (Note, I'm not saying you should turn off your emotions when you're debating, I'm saying you shouldn't let them take over the evidence. You can present evidence and point out where someone is verifiably wrong without getting emotional.)

As soon as you guys (yes, I'm speaking personally here) enter argument mode, PAGES of the thread became devoted to your argument. Usually, you guys start throwing insults (either overt or implied) at each other as soon as it starts because there are so many amak vs raptor/aander/tally/whoever arguments. Really guys, the instant you find yourself typing any kind of judgement against the PERSON and not the EVIDENCE (note: this includes "YOUR ARGUMENT SUCKS" type things when you don't have evidence), or typing some kind of statement that has no evidence (that is not clearly a personal opinion) STOP TYPING. "I think Sony is on track to win back fans with this" is a good opinion. "YOU ARE SUCH A CONSOLE FANBOY THIS IS CLEARLY MEANINGLESS" is a bad one. It's an equally valid opinion, but it shouldn't be expressed in that manner. You guys have almost all done this, I'm not leveling this at any one of you specifically. If I see more, I'm going to start liberally dispensing warnings and/or temp bans (possibly with a long explanation of what is good and what isn't).

Discussion and debate are good things, but not when they completely monopolize a thread (usually) or when they turn into a personal argument. I'm making no comments on the arguments themselves here, and I don't intend to make my opinions known because they are irrelevant to this; but it does look like you guys almost gang up on amak when he expresses a pro-sony opinion. Just because his opinion may be wrong or he may not have the best evidence is no reason to spend the next page and half trying to explain to him why he's wrong and getting mad when he doesn't accept your points. And that applies to everyone here, not just amak.

Now, stop arguing. Debate is fine. Pro and con discussions are fine. If you want to discuss this post further, you all have my IMs or can send me a PM (which includes me pointing out the problems in your posts. If you want to know exactly why I called you guys out, tell me and I'll go through and point out the specific problems in PM or IM or whatever). If you want to argue among yourselves privately, that's fine. Raptor, at one point you said you don't have anything to say to amak you won't say publicly: that may be true, and that's probably a good thing, but that doesn't mean you SHOULD say it publicly. Just 'cause you are willing to say it, doesn't make it appropriate.

Back to sony discussion!

[blazingamer]

Back to sony discussion!

FREE STUFF!!

[vedicardi]

morality police uh oh

[aander91]

Some of the new security measures include "automated software monitoring and configuration management to help defend against new attacks," enhanced levels of data protection, encryption and software that can detect intrusions within the network.

Why weren't these there in the first place? The last one sounds like it should be commonplace.

[Rapt0r]

Some of the new security measures include "automated software monitoring and configuration management to help defend against new attacks," enhanced levels of data protection, encryption and software that can detect intrusions within the network.

Why weren't these there in the first place? The last one sounds like it should be commonplace.

Because Sony thought the PS3 was a new Titanic. Turns out they were right.

[Jama7301]

Some of the new security measures include "automated software monitoring and configuration management to help defend against new attacks," enhanced levels of data protection, encryption and software that can detect intrusions within the network.

Why weren't these there in the first place? The last one sounds like it should be commonplace.

Because Sony thought the PS3 was a new Titanic. Turns out they were right.

That's a pretty apt analogy.

Bravo sir.