AGH!! (Sync Problems)

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AGH!! (Sync Problems)

Postby Electro Tomato » Sun Apr 26, 2009 4:27 pm

I need serious help. I need to know how the pros synch their songs. Every. Fcking. Song. I. Try. To. Fret. Goes. Off. Synch.

MixMeister is crap and doesn't help, and tap BPM is unreliable.
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Re: AGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111!one!!!

Postby mydeepestdream » Sun Apr 26, 2009 4:36 pm

I use Ask the DJ for BPM.

I have never had sync issues (ever since I started making high quality songs at least).

I use EOF and fret by ear.

Do you use dB?
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Re: AGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111!one!!!

Postby raynebc » Sun Apr 26, 2009 4:39 pm

1. Mixmeister DOES work, but it cannot detect a suitable tempo if the song has tempo changes left and right. I have had it give me very accurate tempos to start with.

2. You keep saying you are only willing to use Feedback, yet get upset when it isn't enough to suit your needs. There have been arguments accusing/denying the Chart2Mid utility of desyncing charts. I'm still inclined to believe that it is feasible, since Feedback doesn't handle MIDI natively.

With as much trouble as you're having, EOF is still probably your best bet. If a song has no tempo changes, all I have to do is set Mixmeister's estimation, sync the first beat marker and listen to the metronome. Every several measures, I can adjust a beat marker (creating an anchor). Then when I delete the anchor, the sync I did stays in effect and I listen to several more measures to repeat the process. If a song stays on a single tempo the entire time perfectly (this does happen in some songs), then you can easily get by with no tempo changes in your chart. If there are tempo slips/changes, then instead of deleting the anchors, leave them in place. If you notice a trend where you're always having to shift beat markers earlier/later, the tempo can be increased/decreased accordingly.

Metronome and clap sound cues are the only way to guarantee consistent sync from one computer to another. You can accept these tested methods as the truth or continue refusing to use an editor with more features.
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Re: AGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111!one!!!

Postby Nathaniel607 » Sun Apr 26, 2009 5:44 pm

This is what I do, and according to DDMD, the song I entered to the comp was well synched, and the rest of my songs are the same. I usually use a tab to get the BPM, it tells you above the first mesure in GPro and Tuxguitar. If you don't have a tab, here is what I do, I use EoF;

1. Pick any places in the song where you beliebe there are significant tempos changes (greater than 10), you can usually tell, because the drummer will do a fill, then start playing faster/slower.

(steps 2-4 if there are any BPM changes)

2. Cut the song in audacity from the start to the first tempo change, then save that audio as a file.

3. Then go from the first tempo change to the second, cut, save, repeat.

4. You should now have a couple of different audio files.

5. Now test your audio in Mixmeister.

6. Take note of the tempo(s).

7. Use that as your starting tempo. if it goes out of synch, shift+drag.

8. When you get to a tempo change, input it.

BTW, EoF pwns feedback.
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Re: AGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111!one!!!

Postby venom426 » Sun Apr 26, 2009 7:20 pm

I never understood Anchors.
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Re: AGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111!one!!!

Postby raynebc » Sun Apr 26, 2009 7:26 pm

The concept of an anchor is that when you drag a beat marker, it affects other beat markers as well. An anchor locks the beat marker in place so if you drag a beat marker before or after the anchor, the anchor and all beat markers on the other side of the anchor remain in place. This is the most effective method to correct when there are minor or major tempo slips.

Changing a tempo will still move an anchor after the tempo change.
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Re: AGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111!one!!!

Postby venom426 » Sun Apr 26, 2009 7:32 pm

Holy crap, I get it now!
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Re: AGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111!one!!!

Postby Electro Tomato » Sun Apr 26, 2009 7:41 pm

It's not dB's fault that certain songs (PROGENIES OF THE GREAT APOCALYPSE GRRR!!!) seem to line up perfectly for two measures, then just die. I've tried getting GP tabs and using that, but the difference in how it sounds and how perfectly it lines up are two different things. Here's the usual generic scenario:

1) I use MixMeister to get the BPM.
2) I move the BPM until a beat lines up with the first note and adjust time signature accordingly (I know that we don't have to worry about time signature but bleh)
3) I begin fretting.
4) The song will fret right for a while, but there will be some sort of sustain that lands in between the light beat lines.
5) If I continue to fret, it stays off.
6) If I keep adjusting the beatlines, it looks like a mess of inconsistent beatlines.

I'm going to try Ask the DJ.
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Re: AGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111!one!!!

Postby Electro Tomato » Sun Apr 26, 2009 7:50 pm

raynebc wrote:This is why it's best to create a "tempo map" before you lay down actual notes. That way you have sync taken care of before you worry about note placement.

Tempo map?
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Re: AGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111!one!!!

Postby RealCheese » Sun Apr 26, 2009 7:55 pm

Those who claim the Chart2Mid desyncs the cart are terribly wrong. IThat was my original opinion also, but after opening one of Puppetz songs in Feedback 0.97b I noticed that is was off-sync. Puppetz frets with 0.96 not 0.97 so apparently 0.97 throws your chart off-sync.... If this is the version you are using... then this is your problem.
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Re: AGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111!one!!!

Postby Electro Tomato » Sun Apr 26, 2009 8:00 pm

Well I mean that the songs desyncs as I chart it. But I'll switch to .96.
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Re: AGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111!one!!!

Postby raynebc » Sun Apr 26, 2009 8:04 pm

Electro Tomato wrote:Tempo map?


"Tempo map" is more of a MIDI term to describe the collective tempo changes in the file. This is where all beat markers have been appropriately adjusted so that the metronome ticks on beat through the entire song, also known by drummers as a "click track."
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Re: AGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111!one!!!

Postby RealCheese » Sun Apr 26, 2009 8:22 pm

raynebc wrote:
Electro Tomato wrote:Tempo map?


"Tempo map" is more of a MIDI term to describe the collective tempo changes in the file. This is where all beat markers have been appropriately adjusted so that the metronome ticks on beat through the entire song, also known by drummers as a "click track."


How do you do I find that?

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